RTI for citizens Right to Information: March 2012

Saturday, March 31, 2012

Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

Yes Sir, I am a Signalman. Did OST-_14. Now residing at Gurgaon and looking after NETAJI SUBHASH BOSE - INA TRUST.

Glad to hear from You.

Brig R S Chhikara

From: Jasminder Dhillon <biloodhilon@yahoo.com>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Saturday, 31 March 2012 9:59 PM
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

Dear Sir,

It is nice to see your name on the mail.

Are you from Army Signals as we had an officer at Mhow during 1966-67, when I was doing Signals-OST-16.

with warm raegards,

Col Baldev Dhillon,

Chandigarh

--- On Sat, 3/31/12, rs chhikara <chhikarars1940@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: rs chhikara <chhikarars1940@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, March 31, 2012, 9:48 AM

Waiting for Some one else to come and do it for you?
Sorry - That is not good.
True; It is the Jawans and the Kisans only who suffer most but can they come together to cleanse the system. All that is needed is a million men in Delhi for two weeks and a national government of carefully selected people can be put in place for one term of 4 years. This can bring about all the changes.

Army is not the answer. Who knows - there may be rogue elements there too. Who will then remove the Musharraf or the Kayani?

'WE THE PEOPLE ?

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, capt beniwal <trident142@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: capt beniwal <trident142@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 8:26 PM

sir i shall wait for a indian musharraf or kiyani for few years to put the politicians+babus+ some judges in thier right places. presently they all have become kings and have designed the rules to enjoy every thing to do thing arbitrarily.

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 10:59 AM

The genesis of the entire imbroglio is the endeavour on part of General VK Singh to cleanse the Army as well as the MOD of deep rooted corruption and the well entrenched nexus between the Brokers,MOD and and a few rogue Army Officers involved in the procurement process of Defence Equipment.

People are questioning as to why the matter is being raised at this stage just on the eve of his retirement. The answer is that , had he gone about the same way earlier, he would not have been allowed to complete even two years of his tenure. They would have found ways to provoke him and even could have engineered defiance / levelling of allegations by the subordinates and coterie of aspring senior Generals who are cultivated by the Bureaucrats, to subjugate and undermine the authority of highest Armed Forces Leadership.Look at the treatment meted out to our finest General, Field Martial Maneckshaw who secured an unprecented and unparalleled Victory in the war against Pakistan and creation of Bangladesh. This bunch of arrogant sycophants , utterly incompetent ,ruthless and having a straglehold on all depts of Govt at the center as well as states is the real bane of this country. Even their counter parts in the Police and other Depts and feel stifled and frustrated because if their control and say in all policy matters.so while General Singh coulld succeed in taking disciplinary action against Army Personnel, the moment he stepped on the MOD territory ,this well planned slur campaign against him was set into motion. They were further emboldened as the Armed Forces by and large were mute spectators to the injustice meted out to him in the DOB acrimony which again was engineered by vested interests which shamefullly included not only general Deepak Kapoor and Avadesh Prasad but also General JJ singh who together masterminded this to ensure his early exit.

Having had success in engineering the sacking of Admiral Bhagwat earlier ,the political class and this scheming bureaucracy wanted a repeat of the Bhagwat like ouster to send a chilling message to the Forces in particular. However unlike in Admiral Bhagwat's case ,this time all Retired generals without exception and their equivalent in other two services have rallied behind General VK Singh because they all have had a taste of the Helplessness and stifled existence in the Service HQs and first hand experience of the autocratic and repressive functioning of the bureaucracy.

It would have been the easiest course of action for him to curry favour with the Govt ,retire on 31 May 12 and secure a GOVERNOR'S tenure for atleast five years like his predecessors, as a price of his silence and acquiescence. Any ordinary mortal would have done that ,but not this man of integrity and honour.a true crusador who has had to suffer tremendous humiliation at the fag end of his glorious career. He not only deserves our appreciation and gratitude for his attempt to cleanse the rot in the MOD and the Govt . He is the true Bharat Ratna.

To that extent Gene

On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 5:17 AM, Randhir Sethi <shebon@gmail.com> wrote:

we have ourselves to blame for the state of the nation

even now it is not too late to rise as ONE , and rid ourselves of this
menace /cancer

bubbles

On 3/29/12, Devasahayam MG <mgd@airtelmail.in> wrote:
> The MoD mess–The Reality
>
> Ex-Major M.G.Devasahayam, 1AS
> (Retd)
>
>
>
> Theopen feud between the Ministry of Defence and the Chief of the Army
> Staff aroseout of the contrived Date of Birth controversy. A corrupt cabal
> had conspiredsince 2006 to truncate Gen. VK Singh's tenure by digging out
> UPSC applicationform and trashing his School Certificate.
>
> Yet, neither the DoB issue is over yet, as is beingwrongly believed, nor
> is the tenure of General VK Singh going to end in thenext two months as is
> being widely claimed. The fact is that Supreme Court hasput the ball back
> in the court of MoD by ruling: "As a matter of fact, thequestion before us
> in the Writ Petition is not about the determination ofactual date of birth
> of the petitioner, butit concerns the recognition of a particular date of
> birth of the petitioner bythe respondent (Government of India) in the
> official service record."
>
> It is therefore imperative that the MoDhas to first pass a legally speaking
> order 'recognising' Gen.VK Singh's realDoB as per law and Rules that hold
> School Certificate as paramount. This hasnot been done and the retirement
> orders of Gen VK Singh have not been served onhim till now. Yet MoD has
> nominated and named his successor (for whose benefit the entire conspiracy
> and manipulation took place) to take over asCOAS on 31 May 2012.
>
> This action is untenable and the real cause of the messthat MoD has got
> into and only they are to be blamed. Instead they are tryingto pass it on
> to Gen. VK Singh by insinuating that he is now a 'frustrated man'and is
> trying to rake up the Tatra bribery issue and leaking out his letter
> on'defence preparedness' to PM to seek revenge. Some MPs, including
> congenitally corruptones, have asked for Gen VK Singh's summary dismissal
> and arrest without evenholding an enquiry!
>
> This way of portraying theserving chief of the Indian Army as an adversary
> just because he is fightingagainst corruption and injustice is wrought with
> serious danger andconsequences. It is our Armed Forces who have defended
> and protected ourdemocracy through their valour, sacrifice and total sense
> of patriotism, bereftof any political ambitions as in our neighbouring
> countries. It is largelybecause of them that India stands tall as a free
> and sovereign Republic. Among the armed forces, the Army is the largest
> andthe most visible face. The chief of that force has a special status in
> thenation's affairs and he cannot be distinguished from the Institution he
> heads. When aninstitution like the Army is impaled, it is the people who
> bleed.
>
> Thepolitico-bureaucratic power coterie that is trying to bulldoze the Army
> Chiefis very distressing. If the serving Army Chief is treated this way and
> thesecorrupt cabals have their final say at least for two generations, no
> militarycommander will raise his head. And the message for military
> commanders will bethat it isn't merit, honesty or integrity that will get
> them promotions andtenures but pandering to the corrupt
> politico-bureaucratic cabal. The lastbastion of professional meritocracy in
> India will be crumbled and the damagewill be lasting.
>
> *This is an open war between the honest and the corrupt and cannot

> becountenanced in the interest of national security and integrity in
> governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..*
>

Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

chhikara sir, i fully agree with you thats the best way but inspite of all efforts of many including of like anna/ramdev, to bring people together to a size which matters as suggested by you , yet not sucessful. but a single army person, suddenly can do that shake up ( for good or bad is another thing,) and atleast we will get rid of the present lot and rot. then during the transition people can decide the way forward. to day its jungle raj- meri lathi mere bhains. today minister/babus and judges give orders arbitrarily and under present system/rules no one can do any thing to them. rgds. beniwal

--- On Sat, 31/3/12, Jasminder Dhillon <biloodhilon@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Jasminder Dhillon <biloodhilon@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, 31 March, 2012, 9:59 PM

Dear Sir,

It is nice to see your name on the mail.

Are you from Army Signals as we had an officer at Mhow during 1966-67, when I was doing Signals-OST-16.

with warm raegards,

Col Baldev Dhillon,

Chandigarh

--- On Sat, 3/31/12, rs chhikara <chhikarars1940@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: rs chhikara <chhikarars1940@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, March 31, 2012, 9:48 AM

Waiting for Some one else to come and do it for you?
Sorry - That is not good.
True; It is the Jawans and the Kisans only who suffer most but can they come together to cleanse the system. All that is needed is a million men in Delhi for two weeks and a national government of carefully selected people can be put in place for one term of 4 years. This can bring about all the changes.

Army is not the answer. Who knows - there may be rogue elements there too. Who will then remove the Musharraf or the Kayani?

'WE THE PEOPLE ?

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, capt beniwal <trident142@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: capt beniwal <trident142@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 8:26 PM

sir i shall wait for a indian musharraf or kiyani for few years to put the politicians+babus+ some judges in thier right places. presently they all have become kings and have designed the rules to enjoy every thing to do thing arbitrarily.

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 10:59 AM

The genesis of the entire imbroglio is the endeavour on part of General VK Singh to cleanse the Army as well as the MOD of deep rooted corruption and the well entrenched nexus between the Brokers,MOD and and a few rogue Army Officers involved in the procurement process of Defence Equipment.

People are questioning as to why the matter is being raised at this stage just on the eve of his retirement. The answer is that , had he gone about the same way earlier, he would not have been allowed to complete even two years of his tenure. They would have found ways to provoke him and even could have engineered defiance / levelling of allegations by the subordinates and coterie of aspring senior Generals who are cultivated by the Bureaucrats, to subjugate and undermine the authority of highest Armed Forces Leadership.Look at the treatment meted out to our finest General, Field Martial Maneckshaw who secured an unprecented and unparalleled Victory in the war against Pakistan and creation of Bangladesh. This bunch of arrogant sycophants , utterly incompetent ,ruthless and having a straglehold on all depts of Govt at the center as well as states is the real bane of this country. Even their counter parts in the Police and other Depts and feel stifled and frustrated because if their control and say in all policy matters.so while General Singh coulld succeed in taking disciplinary action against Army Personnel, the moment he stepped on the MOD territory ,this well planned slur campaign against him was set into motion. They were further emboldened as the Armed Forces by and large were mute spectators to the injustice meted out to him in the DOB acrimony which again was engineered by vested interests which shamefullly included not only general Deepak Kapoor and Avadesh Prasad but also General JJ singh who together masterminded this to ensure his early exit.

Having had success in engineering the sacking of Admiral Bhagwat earlier ,the political class and this scheming bureaucracy wanted a repeat of the Bhagwat like ouster to send a chilling message to the Forces in particular. However unlike in Admiral Bhagwat's case ,this time all Retired generals without exception and their equivalent in other two services have rallied behind General VK Singh because they all have had a taste of the Helplessness and stifled existence in the Service HQs and first hand experience of the autocratic and repressive functioning of the bureaucracy.

It would have been the easiest course of action for him to curry favour with the Govt ,retire on 31 May 12 and secure a GOVERNOR'S tenure for atleast five years like his predecessors, as a price of his silence and acquiescence. Any ordinary mortal would have done that ,but not this man of integrity and honour.a true crusador who has had to suffer tremendous humiliation at the fag end of his glorious career. He not only deserves our appreciation and gratitude for his attempt to cleanse the rot in the MOD and the Govt . He is the true Bharat Ratna.

To that extent Gene

On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 5:17 AM, Randhir Sethi <shebon@gmail.com> wrote:

we have ourselves to blame for the state of the nation

even now it is not too late to rise as ONE , and rid ourselves of this
menace /cancer

bubbles

On 3/29/12, Devasahayam MG <mgd@airtelmail.in> wrote:
> The MoD mess–The Reality
>
> Ex-Major M.G.Devasahayam, 1AS
> (Retd)
>
>
>
> Theopen feud between the Ministry of Defence and the Chief of the Army
> Staff aroseout of the contrived Date of Birth controversy. A corrupt cabal
> had conspiredsince 2006 to truncate Gen. VK Singh's tenure by digging out
> UPSC applicationform and trashing his School Certificate.
>
> Yet, neither the DoB issue is over yet, as is beingwrongly believed, nor
> is the tenure of General VK Singh going to end in thenext two months as is
> being widely claimed. The fact is that Supreme Court hasput the ball back
> in the court of MoD by ruling: "As a matter of fact, thequestion before us
> in the Writ Petition is not about the determination ofactual date of birth
> of the petitioner, butit concerns the recognition of a particular date of
> birth of the petitioner bythe respondent (Government of India) in the
> official service record."
>
> It is therefore imperative that the MoDhas to first pass a legally speaking
> order 'recognising' Gen.VK Singh's realDoB as per law and Rules that hold
> School Certificate as paramount. This hasnot been done and the retirement
> orders of Gen VK Singh have not been served onhim till now. Yet MoD has
> nominated and named his successor (for whose benefit the entire conspiracy
> and manipulation took place) to take over asCOAS on 31 May 2012.
>
> This action is untenable and the real cause of the messthat MoD has got
> into and only they are to be blamed. Instead they are tryingto pass it on
> to Gen. VK Singh by insinuating that he is now a 'frustrated man'and is
> trying to rake up the Tatra bribery issue and leaking out his letter
> on'defence preparedness' to PM to seek revenge. Some MPs, including
> congenitally corruptones, have asked for Gen VK Singh's summary dismissal
> and arrest without evenholding an enquiry!
>
> This way of portraying theserving chief of the Indian Army as an adversary
> just because he is fightingagainst corruption and injustice is wrought with
> serious danger andconsequences. It is our Armed Forces who have defended
> and protected ourdemocracy through their valour, sacrifice and total sense
> of patriotism, bereftof any political ambitions as in our neighbouring
> countries. It is largelybecause of them that India stands tall as a free
> and sovereign Republic. Among the armed forces, the Army is the largest
> andthe most visible face. The chief of that force has a special status in
> thenation's affairs and he cannot be distinguished from the Institution he
> heads. When aninstitution like the Army is impaled, it is the people who
> bleed.
>
> Thepolitico-bureaucratic power coterie that is trying to bulldoze the Army
> Chiefis very distressing. If the serving Army Chief is treated this way and
> thesecorrupt cabals have their final say at least for two generations, no
> militarycommander will raise his head. And the message for military
> commanders will bethat it isn't merit, honesty or integrity that will get
> them promotions andtenures but pandering to the corrupt
> politico-bureaucratic cabal. The lastbastion of professional meritocracy in
> India will be crumbled and the damagewill be lasting.
>
> *This is an open war between the honest and the corrupt and cannot

> becountenanced in the interest of national security and integrity in
> governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..*
>

Re: [HumJanenge] The General and the MOD

My dear friend,

You are RIGHT.

MOD is the conspirator, colluder & colaborator.

My experience is--when army raises the issue of HIGH PRICE by PSU, reply is

" Why do you worry-- IT IS JUST BOOK TRANSFER.

GOD bless GENERAL for bringing the issye.

Regards.

Col S N Aggarwal-Veteran

On Sat, 31 Mar 2012 18:31:23 +0530 wrote
>

All of us have become champions in giving evasive replies on debates in the media.

In the procurement of Tatra vehicles here are some simple points to think about...

1. The Army is the user.

2. The MOD is the buyer.

3. BEML, under the MOD is the seller.

4. The BEML purchases from abroad at Rs 40 Lakhs per vehicle. The MOD fixes the price of Rs 1.10 Cr to sell to the army.

5. How can the MOD take action on the issue raised by the COAS when the MOD itself is the user, buyer and seller.

6. The army as a user has to initiate the procurement orders; beyond that they have no role that is why Rs 14 Cr is a very very cheap price

7. The MOD is the conspirator, the colluder and the collaborator.

8. Antony should be in jail but like Manmohan Singh he will say 'he has no idea'.

9. Kapil Sibal will say with his arrogant smirk "zero loss" as technically the funds have moved from one head of account of MOD ie. the Army to BEML both under MOD.

10. Ultimately the legal brains in the party of the day will find ways and means to transfer the loot to the party funds.

I continue to remain appalled at the depth of the debate on all channels wherein no one addresses the basic issues but gets emotional about terms like morale, loyalty and integrity. India is a great country and believes in reconciliation and forgiveness so NOTHING will happen.

With best regards

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Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

Dear Sir,

It is nice to see your name on the mail.

Are you from Army Signals as we had an officer at Mhow during 1966-67, when I was doing Signals-OST-16.

with warm raegards,

Col Baldev Dhillon,

Chandigarh

--- On Sat, 3/31/12, rs chhikara <chhikarars1940@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: rs chhikara <chhikarars1940@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Saturday, March 31, 2012, 9:48 AM

Waiting for Some one else to come and do it for you?
Sorry - That is not good.
True; It is the Jawans and the Kisans only who suffer most but can they come together to cleanse the system. All that is needed is a million men in Delhi for two weeks and a national government of carefully selected people can be put in place for one term of 4 years. This can bring about all the changes.

Army is not the answer. Who knows - there may be rogue elements there too. Who will then remove the Musharraf or the Kayani?

'WE THE PEOPLE ?

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, capt beniwal <trident142@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: capt beniwal <trident142@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 8:26 PM

sir i shall wait for a indian musharraf or kiyani for few years to put the politicians+babus+ some judges in thier right places. presently they all have become kings and have designed the rules to enjoy every thing to do thing arbitrarily.

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 10:59 AM

The genesis of the entire imbroglio is the endeavour on part of General VK Singh to cleanse the Army as well as the MOD of deep rooted corruption and the well entrenched nexus between the Brokers,MOD and and a few rogue Army Officers involved in the procurement process of Defence Equipment.

People are questioning as to why the matter is being raised at this stage just on the eve of his retirement. The answer is that , had he gone about the same way earlier, he would not have been allowed to complete even two years of his tenure. They would have found ways to provoke him and even could have engineered defiance / levelling of allegations by the subordinates and coterie of aspring senior Generals who are cultivated by the Bureaucrats, to subjugate and undermine the authority of highest Armed Forces Leadership.Look at the treatment meted out to our finest General, Field Martial Maneckshaw who secured an unprecented and unparalleled Victory in the war against Pakistan and creation of Bangladesh. This bunch of arrogant sycophants , utterly incompetent ,ruthless and having a straglehold on all depts of Govt at the center as well as states is the real bane of this country. Even their counter parts in the Police and other Depts and feel stifled and frustrated because if their control and say in all policy matters.so while General Singh coulld succeed in taking disciplinary action against Army Personnel, the moment he stepped on the MOD territory ,this well planned slur campaign against him was set into motion. They were further emboldened as the Armed Forces by and large were mute spectators to the injustice meted out to him in the DOB acrimony which again was engineered by vested interests which shamefullly included not only general Deepak Kapoor and Avadesh Prasad but also General JJ singh who together masterminded this to ensure his early exit.

Having had success in engineering the sacking of Admiral Bhagwat earlier ,the political class and this scheming bureaucracy wanted a repeat of the Bhagwat like ouster to send a chilling message to the Forces in particular. However unlike in Admiral Bhagwat's case ,this time all Retired generals without exception and their equivalent in other two services have rallied behind General VK Singh because they all have had a taste of the Helplessness and stifled existence in the Service HQs and first hand experience of the autocratic and repressive functioning of the bureaucracy.

It would have been the easiest course of action for him to curry favour with the Govt ,retire on 31 May 12 and secure a GOVERNOR'S tenure for atleast five years like his predecessors, as a price of his silence and acquiescence. Any ordinary mortal would have done that ,but not this man of integrity and honour.a true crusador who has had to suffer tremendous humiliation at the fag end of his glorious career. He not only deserves our appreciation and gratitude for his attempt to cleanse the rot in the MOD and the Govt . He is the true Bharat Ratna.

To that extent Gene

On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 5:17 AM, Randhir Sethi <shebon@gmail.com> wrote:

we have ourselves to blame for the state of the nation

even now it is not too late to rise as ONE , and rid ourselves of this
menace /cancer

bubbles

On 3/29/12, Devasahayam MG <mgd@airtelmail.in> wrote:
> The MoD mess–The Reality
>
> Ex-Major M.G.Devasahayam, 1AS
> (Retd)
>
>
>
> Theopen feud between the Ministry of Defence and the Chief of the Army
> Staff aroseout of the contrived Date of Birth controversy. A corrupt cabal
> had conspiredsince 2006 to truncate Gen. VK Singh's tenure by digging out
> UPSC applicationform and trashing his School Certificate.
>
> Yet, neither the DoB issue is over yet, as is beingwrongly believed, nor
> is the tenure of General VK Singh going to end in thenext two months as is
> being widely claimed. The fact is that Supreme Court hasput the ball back
> in the court of MoD by ruling: "As a matter of fact, thequestion before us
> in the Writ Petition is not about the determination ofactual date of birth
> of the petitioner, butit concerns the recognition of a particular date of
> birth of the petitioner bythe respondent (Government of India) in the
> official service record."
>
> It is therefore imperative that the MoDhas to first pass a legally speaking
> order 'recognising' Gen.VK Singh's realDoB as per law and Rules that hold
> School Certificate as paramount. This hasnot been done and the retirement
> orders of Gen VK Singh have not been served onhim till now. Yet MoD has
> nominated and named his successor (for whose benefit the entire conspiracy
> and manipulation took place) to take over asCOAS on 31 May 2012.
>
> This action is untenable and the real cause of the messthat MoD has got
> into and only they are to be blamed. Instead they are tryingto pass it on
> to Gen. VK Singh by insinuating that he is now a 'frustrated man'and is
> trying to rake up the Tatra bribery issue and leaking out his letter
> on'defence preparedness' to PM to seek revenge. Some MPs, including
> congenitally corruptones, have asked for Gen VK Singh's summary dismissal
> and arrest without evenholding an enquiry!
>
> This way of portraying theserving chief of the Indian Army as an adversary
> just because he is fightingagainst corruption and injustice is wrought with
> serious danger andconsequences. It is our Armed Forces who have defended
> and protected ourdemocracy through their valour, sacrifice and total sense
> of patriotism, bereftof any political ambitions as in our neighbouring
> countries. It is largelybecause of them that India stands tall as a free
> and sovereign Republic. Among the armed forces, the Army is the largest
> andthe most visible face. The chief of that force has a special status in
> thenation's affairs and he cannot be distinguished from the Institution he
> heads. When aninstitution like the Army is impaled, it is the people who
> bleed.
>
> Thepolitico-bureaucratic power coterie that is trying to bulldoze the Army
> Chiefis very distressing. If the serving Army Chief is treated this way and
> thesecorrupt cabals have their final say at least for two generations, no
> militarycommander will raise his head. And the message for military
> commanders will bethat it isn't merit, honesty or integrity that will get
> them promotions andtenures but pandering to the corrupt
> politico-bureaucratic cabal. The lastbastion of professional meritocracy in
> India will be crumbled and the damagewill be lasting.
>
> *This is an open war between the honest and the corrupt and cannot

> becountenanced in the interest of national security and integrity in
> governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..*
>

Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

It is high time we the people of India recognise the need to stand with people like Gen V K Singh. What Gen V K has said today is very serious a matter which has been troubling like minded army officers for decades but did not dare to voice their concern and if some one tried it was killed in the bud by some senior in the chain of command like it is being done by the MOD or some politicians now. The threat to the nation is bigger than we can imagine. In fact the Army today is unfit for war at a short notice, equipment worth of crores is lying useless in unserviceable condition for lack of spares n new weapons n equipment is not bought for decades for so many reasons.Defence procurement has become a problem in the nation. Our politicians think we may not be required to go in for war at all n complete Army is no more required in the nation n it is only there to meet their corrupt end. If we are required to go to war say with china tomorrow it need min 6M to an Year of preparedness which means immediate need for purchase of new weapon n equipment from other nation which could be very costly or blackmail by some super power. This is a game being played by the nation.The politicians of this nation has no love lost for this nation or under certain obligation to certain black forces who may be black mailing them due to their dark past. Today they are threatening the COAS for dismissal as they did in Admiral Bhagvati's case,if they do it the country along with army must rise to the occasion n teach them a lesson.It is high time that PM must take immediate and sincere action on the letter of Gen V K and ensure a corruption free dealing in the future procurement of the Army needs on priority.

From: Mahesh Khera <mkkhera@yahoo.com>
To: "humjanenge@googlegroups.com" <humjanenge@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Friday, 30 March 2012 12:54 PM
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

Dear Friends,

This is not a rocket science to know that right from water, food, health care, sand, stone, metals, roads, land, construction, infrastructure, cable TV, telecom, ... to alcohol, India is run by mafia enjoying open support of some politicians, some babus, some policemen and some judges.

The defence procurement has always been actually run again by mafia given sophisticated name as middlemen in covert support by some politicians and some babus even miniscule greedy service officers who get lured, punished for accepting a pittance as a graft and then repent to their nears and dears for rest of their life. No politician, no babus have ever been tried out for any defence deal scandals. The political class conveniently covers it up by saying this is sensitive issue and can not be discussed. On the other hand, Armed Forces ruthlessly punish the service officers even for a small graft. There are no sympathies for even small graft takers.

General VK Singh has stood so tall that no neta, no babu, no one else can even touch him and by showing to the world that there are still honest service chiefs who would fight for the truth and justice till the end.

Through this most respected forum, I request all activists to gather as much truth as possible with a flood of RTI applications and uncover the treason being caused by the nexus of some netas and some babus.India needs to send these traitors to jails for life. Lets keep our political affiliations aside and come together in this national cause which if not checked by we the people might one worst day result into a situation which happened with Soviet Union and the world's second largest might broke up in late eighties.

My special appeal to the media to only bring out the truth and not call up those netas and retired babus on TV who would try their best to convert all lies into truth, treason into loyalty and loyalty into treason.

Jai Hind.

With warm regards,

Mahesh Khera

From: prakash joshi <colprakashjoshi@yahoo.com>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, 30 March 2012 12:06 AM
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

I am with you and we must do something about it.
Least we can do is pass it on to 10/20 known people and hope it spreads like wild fire secondly keep the issue alive lest the politicians(i mean the die hard corrupt ones---- with power and money ). Memory of public is short ----politicians as above are shrewd ..will contort facts and feed it to our public like master of the art of misinformation German Gen Goebel did in WWII.PLEASE keep the issue alive in all venues whenever one get a chance.
THE COUNTRY MUST LEARN TO RESPECT ELDERS/SOLDIERS/REAL PATRIOTS........OR ELSE WE AS A COUNTRY ARE DOOMED.EARLIER WE REALISE THIS, BETTER FOR US INDIANS.JAI HIND.

From: Devasahayam MG <mgd@airtelmail.in>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 29 March 2012 7:27 PM
Subject: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

The MoD mess–The Reality

Ex-Major M.G.Devasahayam, 1AS (Retd)

Theopen feud between the Ministry of Defence and the Chief of the Army Staff aroseout of the contrived Date of Birth controversy. A corrupt cabal had conspiredsince 2006 to truncate Gen. VK Singh's tenure by digging out UPSC applicationform and trashing his School Certificate.

Yet, neither the DoB issue is over yet, as is beingwrongly believed, nor is the tenure of General VK Singh going to end in thenext two months as is being widely claimed. The fact is that Supreme Court hasput the ball back in the court of MoD by ruling: "As a matter of fact, thequestion before us in the Writ Petition is not about the determination ofactual date of birth of the petitioner, butit concerns the recognition of a particular date of birth of the petitioner bythe respondent (Government of India) in the official service record."

It is therefore imperative that the MoDhas to first pass a legally speaking order 'recognising' Gen.VK Singh's realDoB as per law and Rules that hold School Certificate as paramount. This hasnot been done and the retirement orders of Gen VK Singh have not been served onhim till now. Yet MoD has nominated and named his successor (for whose benefit the entire conspiracy and manipulation took place) to take over asCOAS on 31 May 2012.

This action is untenable and the real cause of the messthat MoD has got into and only they are to be blamed. Instead they are tryingto pass it on to Gen. VK Singh by insinuating that he is now a 'frustrated man'and is trying to rake up the Tatra bribery issue and leaking out his letter on'defence preparedness' to PM to seek revenge. Some MPs, including congenitally corruptones, have asked for Gen VK Singh's summary dismissal and arrest without evenholding an enquiry!

This way of portraying theserving chief of the Indian Army as an adversary just because he is fightingagainst corruption and injustice is wrought with serious danger andconsequences. It is our Armed Forces who have defended and protected ourdemocracy through their valour, sacrifice and total sense of patriotism, bereftof any political ambitions as in our neighbouring countries. It is largelybecause of them that India stands tall as a free and sovereign Republic. Among the armed forces, the Army is the largest andthe most visible face. The chief of that force has a special status in thenation's affairs and he cannot be distinguished from the Institution he heads. When aninstitution like the Army is impaled, it is the people who bleed.

Thepolitico-bureaucratic power coterie that is trying to bulldoze the Army Chiefis very distressing. If the serving Army Chief is treated this way and thesecorrupt cabals have their final say at least for two generations, no militarycommander will raise his head. And the message for military commanders will bethat it isn't merit, honesty or integrity that will get them promotions andtenures but pandering to the corrupt politico-bureaucratic cabal. The lastbastion of professional meritocracy in India will be crumbled and the damagewill be lasting.

This is an open war between the honest and the corrupt and cannot becountenanced in the interest of national security and integrity in governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: Please think of the Nation

LoL animals, who

On Mar 31, 2012 7:08 AM, "Sarbajit Roy" <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Girish

I am no longer that fool. Having fought (and won) many battles I
realised I could not win the war single-handedly.

If I was asked today how the frustrated masses should "win" the war, I
would say *off the cuff")

1) Acknowledge that humankind is greedy, corrupt and flawed.

2) Acknowledge the basic rule that "all life exists to be consumed".

3) Work individually to a common goal while going about your daily
duties as a householder and social animal

4) Take out the 4th (media) and 5th (NGOs) columnists first. Once
these distractions are out of the way the real battle can be fought.

PS: I nominate Barkha Dutt for journalist of the year

Sarbajit

On 3/30/12, Girish <girishkumar.kp@gmail.com> wrote: > Sarabjit, > > Well said , I think its you. W...

Friday, March 30, 2012

Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

The chief needs support, he was our Col (GS) when I was CO signals, a great soldier, need to support him.

Regards

VK Chhabra

Col

retd

Los Angeles, CA , USA

Sent by ipad

On Mar 30, 2012, at 13:28, umesh rohatgi <rurohatgi@yahoo.com> wrote:

we are all ripe for military rule in India in order to stop this criminalization of politics mand shelter by politicians by legislation and judiciary.
we need it now strengthen the hands of army chief. in India.
umesh rashmi rohatgi

From: prakash joshi <colprakashjoshi@yahoo.com>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2012 2:36 PM
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

I am with you and we must do something about it.
Least we can do is pass it on to 10/20 known people and hope it spreads like wild fire secondly keep the issue alive lest the politicians(i mean the die hard corrupt ones---- with power and money ). Memory of public is short ----politicians as above are shrewd ..will contort facts and feed it to our public like master of the art of misinformation German Gen Goebel did in WWII.PLEASE keep the issue alive in all venues whenever one get a chance.
THE COUNTRY MUST LEARN TO RESPECT ELDERS/SOLDIERS/REAL PATRIOTS........OR ELSE WE AS A COUNTRY ARE DOOMED.EARLIER WE REALISE THIS, BETTER FOR US INDIANS.JAI HIND.

From: Devasahayam MG <mgd@airtelmail.in>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 29 March 2012 7:27 PM
Subject: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

The MoD mess–The Reality
Ex-Major M.G.Devasahayam, 1AS (Retd)

Theopen feud between the Ministry of Defence and the Chief of the Army Staff aroseout of the contrived Date of Birth controversy. A corrupt cabal had conspiredsince 2006 to truncate Gen. VK Singh's tenure by digging out UPSC applicationform and trashing his School Certificate.

Yet, neither the DoB issue is over yet, as is beingwrongly believed, nor is the tenure of General VK Singh going to end in thenext two months as is being widely claimed. The fact is that Supreme Court hasput the ball back in the court of MoD by ruling: "As a matter of fact, thequestion before us in the Writ Petition is not about the determination ofactual date of birth of the petitioner, butit concerns the recognition of a particular date of birth of the petitioner bythe respondent (Government of India) in the official service record."

It is therefore imperative that the MoDhas to first pass a legally speaking order 'recognising' Gen.VK Singh's realDoB as per law and Rules that hold School Certificate as paramount. This hasnot been done and the retirement orders of Gen VK Singh have not been served onhim till now. Yet MoD has nominated and named his successor (for whose benefit the entire conspiracy and manipulation took place) to take over asCOAS on 31 May 2012.

This action is untenable and the real cause of the messthat MoD has got into and only they are to be blamed. Instead they are tryingto pass it on to Gen. VK Singh by insinuating that he is now a 'frustrated man'and is trying to rake up the Tatra bribery issue and leaking out his letter on'defence preparedness' to PM to seek revenge. Some MPs, including congenitally corruptones, have asked for Gen VK Singh's summary dismissal and arrest without evenholding an enquiry!

This way of portraying theserving chief of the Indian Army as an adversary just because he is fightingagainst corruption and injustice is wrought with serious danger andconsequences. It is our Armed Forces who have defended and protected ourdemocracy through their valour, sacrifice and total sense of patriotism, bereftof any political ambitions as in our neighbouring countries. It is largelybecause of them that India stands tall as a free and sovereign Republic. Among the armed forces, the Army is the largest andthe most visible face. The chief of that force has a special status in thenation's affairs and he cannot be distinguished from the Institution he heads. When aninstitution like the Army is impaled, it is the people who bleed.

Thepolitico-bureaucratic power coterie that is trying to bulldoze the Army Chiefis very distressing. If the serving Army Chief is treated this way and thesecorrupt cabals have their final say at least for two generations, no militarycommander will raise his head. And the message for military commanders will bethat it isn't merit, honesty or integrity that will get them promotions andtenures but pandering to the corrupt politico-bureaucratic cabal. The lastbastion of professional meritocracy in India will be crumbled and the damagewill be lasting.

This is an open war between the honest and the corrupt and cannot becountenanced in the interest of national security and integrity in governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..

[HumJanenge] Fwd: Article for Punjab Kesary by Harijai Singh, former Editor-in-Chief of THE TRIBUNE

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Hari Jaisingh <hari.jaisingh@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, Mar 31, 2012 at 9:22 AM
Subject: Fwd article
To: Devasahayam MG mgd@airtelmail.in

___________________________________________________________________________________________

Corruption, and not the General, is the real issue

Hari Jaisingh

General V K Singh has done a great service to the country by,
wittingly or unwittingly, putting the public focus back on two
critical issues of pay-off-bribery in arms procurement, defence
preparedness and modernisation of the armed forces. A meaningful
government of substance should have graciously acknowledged this
instead of raking up technical points of protocol, propriety and
conduct of the army chief - from the age row to the bribery offer to
the letter to the PM through MoD.

Who leaked the letter should be a serious matter of honest
investigation. It is difficult to say the source of leakage, but
whosoever tried to be smart to fix the General and put him in the dock
has apparently miscalculated his moves. The establishment today is
full of such over-smart characters who lack simple commonsense.
Equally disturbing is the suggestion aired in certain quarters that
the General should either be sacked or asked to go on leave. Either
move would have been disastrous while basic issues of honesty,
transparency and accountability in the system of defence operations
are hanging fire.

Whether we like it or not it is a harsh fact in today's scam-ridden
polity that persons of honesty and integrity do not suit the
powers-that-be and vested interests who float on their manipulative
ability to make easy money through massive defence deals and
sub-deals. Who cares if the loser at the other end is the national
exchequer?

Issues arising from General V K Singh's letter and bribe offer claim
cannot be brushed aside by hollow declarations of the defence
minister. I have spoken to a number of armed forces personnel in
recent months who told me candidly about serious gaps in arms and
ammunition of the forces vis a vis alarming expansion of China's
military might. The General's letter to the PM has to be seen as yet
another wake-up call by the General to the civil authorities to
appreciate the ground realities of shortages in special tank
ammunition (APSDS), artillery guns and the army's air defence network.
Army Chief has drawn the attention of the defence minister and the
MoD's key bureaucrats about defence gaps several times during the past
two years. But then, who cares? Obviously, the persons who matter have
conveniently forgotten the lessons from the 1962 disaster at the hands
of China in the north-west frontier.

Why have things come to such a pass? The answers are simple and
straightforward if we address ourselves to the country's security
issue honestly and objectively. As it is, the UPA government continues
to be in a state of drift. It seems to have lost its grip in managing
vital national affairs. Poor leadership caught in the never-ending
saga of scams and corrupt practices have only added to its woes. There
is no point in consoling ourselves by reciting the mantra of "our
honest PM". We do not know what are his problems and compulsions for
this state of helplessness. The people will be solidly behind him if
he moves fast to set the system of governance in order. All that he is
expected to do is to act as Prime Minister of substance. His bechara
image neither helps him nor the country.

Mr Prime Minister, the Army Chief must not be a subject of politics
and witch-hunting for raising the question of his age. Nor should the
entrenched bureaucrats be allowed to play their petty games to fix him
for speaking the truth to their advantage. We have to trust the
General who is entrusted with the onerous task of defending the
national borders.

There can be no shortcuts in defence matters. The country's security
must not be compromised on any count. Unfortunately, we are well aware
of the fact that commissions and kickbacks are part of the
international business scene. Agents and sub-agents operate globally
and create their own islands of influence for kickbacks and
commissions. Many old-timers ask: "In what way is India different from
other countries?" "Have we forgotten Gandhi's insistence on truth"?
"Is austerity in public life derogatory to public office?" There are
no ready answers to such questions.

India has, however, well-defined norms for procurement of weapons.
Generally, a case is presented to the defence ministry by the Service
concerned and the ministry orders an appraisal of the performance cum
cost analysis of various systems available in the world market. An
expert committee at the respective service headquarters then submits a
critical appreciation of various offers received by the ministry.
Thereafter bureaucrats headed by the Defence Minister in consultation
with the Prime Minister decide how, where and which offer is to be
accepted. The deal is finalized directly by the ministry of defence.

What is implied in this procedure is that since Indian defence and
other purchases are mostly on government to government transactions,
there are no middlemen and kickbacks. However, nothing could be
farther from the truth. Political executives and officials involved
both in the seller and buyer countries are influenced by the weapons
manufacturer to facilitate the clinching of a deal that often runs
into hundreds of crores of rupees. Various government outfits are
known to be operating under the cover of some weapons selling agencies
or middlemen operating at various levels.

Take the case of Adnan Khashoggi. He was only 25 years of age when
Lockheed implied him in 1964 as an agent for the sale of Hercules. By
the mid-seventies he represented many multinational arms companies.
His rise was so phenomenal that several kings and presidents were
among his personal friends. He once reportedly said: "If one offers
money to a government to influence it, that is, corruption. But if
someone receives for services rendered afterwards that is a
commission". Such a stance could be taken as an open invitation to
corruption. It could be a dangerous business if bribes are paid to
influence the government and disastrous for a nation if kickbacks are
received by political executives and their nominees. Therein lies the
Indian tragedy.

Kickbacks and other corrupt practices have now become a part of Indian
transactions, so much so that the entire system appears to be corrupt
and hollow. Reversing this corruption-prone trend is not going to be
easy. But the least Dr Manmohan Singh's government could do at this
stage is to ensure a totally honest approach to General V K Singh's
revelations on bribe offer and related matters of defence
preparedness. I know for certain that corruption today is the order of
the day. Still, we have to rise as a nation and put a stop to such
malpractices. We must be honest to ourselves and the nation we all
swear by.

Well, instead of indulging in shadow-boxing against corruption and
black money operators, the PM would do well to take small steps to
tackle the roots of the problem. There is no point in talking big and
doing little. I am of the view that the commissions collected on
account of defence and other business deals must not go into anyone's
pockets. Such big fat commissions must be accounted for and deposited
in the national treasury instead of being pocketed by corrupt
individuals and greedy politico-bureaucratic outfits.

Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

Waiting for Some one else to come and do it for you?
Sorry - That is not good.
True; It is the Jawans and the Kisans only who suffer most but can they come together to cleanse the system. All that is needed is a million men in Delhi for two weeks and a national government of carefully selected people can be put in place for one term of 4 years. This can bring about all the changes.

Army is not the answer. Who knows - there may be rogue elements there too. Who will then remove the Musharraf or the Kayani?

'WE THE PEOPLE ?

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, capt beniwal <trident142@yahoo.co.in> wrote:

From: capt beniwal <trident142@yahoo.co.in>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 8:26 PM

sir i shall wait for a indian musharraf or kiyani for few years to put the politicians+babus+ some judges in thier right places. presently they all have become kings and have designed the rules to enjoy every thing to do thing arbitrarily.

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 10:59 AM

The genesis of the entire imbroglio is the endeavour on part of General VK Singh to cleanse the Army as well as the MOD of deep rooted corruption and the well entrenched nexus between the Brokers,MOD and and a few rogue Army Officers involved in the procurement process of Defence Equipment.

People are questioning as to why the matter is being raised at this stage just on the eve of his retirement. The answer is that , had he gone about the same way earlier, he would not have been allowed to complete even two years of his tenure. They would have found ways to provoke him and even could have engineered defiance / levelling of allegations by the subordinates and coterie of aspring senior Generals who are cultivated by the Bureaucrats, to subjugate and undermine the authority of highest Armed Forces Leadership.Look at the treatment meted out to our finest General, Field Martial Maneckshaw who secured an unprecented and unparalleled Victory in the war against Pakistan and creation of Bangladesh. This bunch of arrogant sycophants , utterly incompetent ,ruthless and having a straglehold on all depts of Govt at the center as well as states is the real bane of this country. Even their counter parts in the Police and other Depts and feel stifled and frustrated because if their control and say in all policy matters.so while General Singh coulld succeed in taking disciplinary action against Army Personnel, the moment he stepped on the MOD territory ,this well planned slur campaign against him was set into motion. They were further emboldened as the Armed Forces by and large were mute spectators to the injustice meted out to him in the DOB acrimony which again was engineered by vested interests which shamefullly included not only general Deepak Kapoor and Avadesh Prasad but also General JJ singh who together masterminded this to ensure his early exit.

Having had success in engineering the sacking of Admiral Bhagwat earlier ,the political class and this scheming bureaucracy wanted a repeat of the Bhagwat like ouster to send a chilling message to the Forces in particular. However unlike in Admiral Bhagwat's case ,this time all Retired generals without exception and their equivalent in other two services have rallied behind General VK Singh because they all have had a taste of the Helplessness and stifled existence in the Service HQs and first hand experience of the autocratic and repressive functioning of the bureaucracy.

It would have been the easiest course of action for him to curry favour with the Govt ,retire on 31 May 12 and secure a GOVERNOR'S tenure for atleast five years like his predecessors, as a price of his silence and acquiescence. Any ordinary mortal would have done that ,but not this man of integrity and honour.a true crusador who has had to suffer tremendous humiliation at the fag end of his glorious career. He not only deserves our appreciation and gratitude for his attempt to cleanse the rot in the MOD and the Govt . He is the true Bharat Ratna.

To that extent Gene

On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 5:17 AM, Randhir Sethi <shebon@gmail.com> wrote:
we have ourselves to blame for the state of the nation

even now it is not too late to rise as ONE , and rid ourselves of this
menace /cancer

bubbles

On 3/29/12, Devasahayam MG <mgd@airtelmail.in> wrote:
> The MoD mess–The Reality
>
> Ex-Major M.G.Devasahayam, 1AS
> (Retd)
>
>
>
> Theopen feud between the Ministry of Defence and the Chief of the Army
> Staff aroseout of the contrived Date of Birth controversy. A corrupt cabal
> had conspiredsince 2006 to truncate Gen. VK Singh's tenure by digging out
> UPSC applicationform and trashing his School Certificate.
>
> Yet, neither the DoB issue is over yet, as is beingwrongly believed, nor
> is the tenure of General VK Singh going to end in thenext two months as is
> being widely claimed. The fact is that Supreme Court hasput the ball back
> in the court of MoD by ruling: "As a matter of fact, thequestion before us
> in the Writ Petition is not about the determination ofactual date of birth
> of the petitioner, butit concerns the recognition of a particular date of
> birth of the petitioner bythe respondent (Government of India) in the
> official service record."
>
> It is therefore imperative that the MoDhas to first pass a legally speaking
> order 'recognising' Gen.VK Singh's realDoB as per law and Rules that hold
> School Certificate as paramount. This hasnot been done and the retirement
> orders of Gen VK Singh have not been served onhim till now. Yet MoD has
> nominated and named his successor (for whose benefit the entire conspiracy
> and manipulation took place) to take over asCOAS on 31 May 2012.
>
> This action is untenable and the real cause of the messthat MoD has got
> into and only they are to be blamed. Instead they are tryingto pass it on
> to Gen. VK Singh by insinuating that he is now a 'frustrated man'and is
> trying to rake up the Tatra bribery issue and leaking out his letter
> on'defence preparedness' to PM to seek revenge. Some MPs, including
> congenitally corruptones, have asked for Gen VK Singh's summary dismissal
> and arrest without evenholding an enquiry!
>
> This way of portraying theserving chief of the Indian Army as an adversary
> just because he is fightingagainst corruption and injustice is wrought with
> serious danger andconsequences. It is our Armed Forces who have defended
> and protected ourdemocracy through their valour, sacrifice and total sense
> of patriotism, bereftof any political ambitions as in our neighbouring
> countries. It is largelybecause of them that India stands tall as a free
> and sovereign Republic. Among the armed forces, the Army is the largest
> andthe most visible face. The chief of that force has a special status in
> thenation's affairs and he cannot be distinguished from the Institution he
> heads. When aninstitution like the Army is impaled, it is the people who
> bleed.
>
> Thepolitico-bureaucratic power coterie that is trying to bulldoze the Army
> Chiefis very distressing. If the serving Army Chief is treated this way and
> thesecorrupt cabals have their final say at least for two generations, no
> militarycommander will raise his head. And the message for military
> commanders will bethat it isn't merit, honesty or integrity that will get
> them promotions andtenures but pandering to the corrupt
> politico-bureaucratic cabal. The lastbastion of professional meritocracy in
> India will be crumbled and the damagewill be lasting.
>

> *This is an open war between the honest and the corrupt and cannot

> becountenanced in the interest of national security and integrity in

> governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..*
>

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: Please think of the Nation

Dear Girish

I am no longer that fool. Having fought (and won) many battles I
realised I could not win the war single-handedly.

If I was asked today how the frustrated masses should "win" the war, I
would say *off the cuff")

1) Acknowledge that humankind is greedy, corrupt and flawed.

2) Acknowledge the basic rule that "all life exists to be consumed".

3) Work individually to a common goal while going about your daily
duties as a householder and social animal

4) Take out the 4th (media) and 5th (NGOs) columnists first. Once
these distractions are out of the way the real battle can be fought.

PS: I nominate Barkha Dutt for journalist of the year

Sarbajit

On 3/30/12, Girish <girishkumar.kp@gmail.com> wrote:
> Sarabjit,
>
> Well said , I think its you. WoW
>
> On Mar 30, 2012 8:40 PM, "sarbajit roy" <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 2 wrongs do not make a right.
> Why should we even discuss options like coup etc.
>
> One of my friends has proposed that the answer is with the patriotic
> EX-Servicemen,
> Each and every patriot must be true and pure and a servant of the
> nation.
>
> He says they must target a particular rank - Director / Joint
> Secretary.
> Each and every corrupt babu in this grade should be cleansed.
>
> He feels in the process the nation will be cleansed and foreign
> parasites exterminated from the face of India, (ie. Bharat) faster
> than they can respawn themselves.
>
> No cause is lost if there is one fool willing to fight for it.

Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

we are all ripe for military rule in India in order to stop this criminalization of politics mand shelter by politicians by legislation and judiciary.

we need it now strengthen the hands of army chief. in India.

umesh rashmi rohatgi

From: prakash joshi <colprakashjoshi@yahoo.com>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2012 2:36 PM
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

From: Devasahayam MG <mgd@airtelmail.in>
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, 29 March 2012 7:27 PM
Subject: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

The MoD mess–The Reality

Ex-Major M.G.Devasahayam, 1AS (Retd)

Re: [HumJanenge] Re: Please think of the Nation

Sarabjit,

Well said , I think its you. WoW

On Mar 30, 2012 8:40 PM, "sarbajit roy" <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

2 wrongs do not make a right.
Why should we even discuss options like coup etc.

One of my friends has proposed that the answer is with the patriotic
EX-Servicemen,
Each and every patriot must be true and pure and a servant of the
nation.

He says they must target a particular rank - Director / Joint
Secretary.
Each and every corrupt babu in this grade should be cleansed.

He feels in the process the nation will be cleansed and foreign
parasites exterminated from the face of India, (ie. Bharat) faster
than they can respawn themselves.

No cause is lost if there is one fool willing to fight for it.

On Mar 30, 7:56 pm, capt beniwal <trident...@yahoo.co.in> wrote: > sir i shall wait for a indian mu...
> > governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..*

[HumJanenge] Re: Please think of the Nation

2 wrongs do not make a right.
Why should we even discuss options like coup etc.

One of my friends has proposed that the answer is with the patriotic
EX-Servicemen,
Each and every patriot must be true and pure and a servant of the
nation.

He says they must target a particular rank - Director / Joint
Secretary.
Each and every corrupt babu in this grade should be cleansed.

He feels in the process the nation will be cleansed and foreign
parasites exterminated from the face of India, (ie. Bharat) faster
than they can respawn themselves.

No cause is lost if there is one fool willing to fight for it.

On Mar 30, 7:56 pm, capt beniwal <trident...@yahoo.co.in> wrote:
> sir i shall wait for a indian musharraf or kiyani for few years to put the politicians+babus+ some judges in thier right places. presently they all have become kings and have designed the rules to enjoy every thing to do thing arbitrarily.
>
> > governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..*

Re: [HumJanenge] Yet another state (Maharashtra) curtails RTI by Rules

150 words rules already in force in Karnataka inspite of many eminent and nationally reputed RTI activists activeness.
Maharashtra has just copied it

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-----Original Message-----
From: Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com>
Sender: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 20:29:27
To: humjanenge<humjanenge@googlegroups.com>
Reply-To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Subject: [HumJanenge] Yet another state (Maharashtra) curtails RTI by Rules

Attached is the PDF of Maharashtra RTI Rules 2012 (amended).

In Maharashtra each RTI request is 150 words maximum on 1 subject. fron now on

This Rule has been drafted by Ms. Aruna Roy, approved by Sonia Gandhi
and passed by PrithviRaj Chavan. All of them being Congressis.

Now a few selected RTIO activists / touts like Krishnaraj Rao will
make a hungama, appeal to Aruna Roy, and they will magnamously
increase the limit to 500 words.

They will then play the same game at the Centre, and stuff the CIC
with handpicked yes men, because the Congress is on the backfoot at
the moment and Rahul "baba's". vote getting power is doubtful (perhaps
he should wear a saree to increase his prospects at the hustings ..
a-la NTR).

[HumJanenge] Yet another state (Maharashtra) curtails RTI by Rules

Attached is the PDF of Maharashtra RTI Rules 2012 (amended).

In Maharashtra each RTI request is 150 words maximum on 1 subject. fron now on

This Rule has been drafted by Ms. Aruna Roy, approved by Sonia Gandhi
and passed by PrithviRaj Chavan. All of them being Congressis.

Now a few selected RTIO activists / touts like Krishnaraj Rao will
make a hungama, appeal to Aruna Roy, and they will magnamously
increase the limit to 500 words.

They will then play the same game at the Centre, and stuff the CIC
with handpicked yes men, because the Congress is on the backfoot at
the moment and Rahul "baba's". vote getting power is doubtful (perhaps
he should wear a saree to increase his prospects at the hustings ..
a-la NTR).

Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation

sir i shall wait for a indian musharraf or kiyani for few years to put the politicians+babus+ some judges in thier right places. presently they all have become kings and have designed the rules to enjoy every thing to do thing arbitrarily.

--- On Fri, 30/3/12, Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Janardan Sharma <contactjps@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [HumJanenge] Please think of the Nation
To: humjanenge@googlegroups.com
Date: Friday, 30 March, 2012, 10:59 AM

The genesis of the entire imbroglio is the endeavour on part of General VK Singh to cleanse the Army as well as the MOD of deep rooted corruption and the well entrenched nexus between the Brokers,MOD and and a few rogue Army Officers involved in the procurement process of Defence Equipment.

People are questioning as to why the matter is being raised at this stage just on the eve of his retirement. The answer is that , had he gone about the same way earlier, he would not have been allowed to complete even two years of his tenure. They would have found ways to provoke him and even could have engineered defiance / levelling of allegations by the subordinates and coterie of aspring senior Generals who are cultivated by the Bureaucrats, to subjugate and undermine the authority of highest Armed Forces Leadership.Look at the treatment meted out to our finest General, Field Martial Maneckshaw who secured an unprecented and unparalleled Victory in the war against Pakistan and creation of Bangladesh. This bunch of arrogant sycophants , utterly incompetent ,ruthless and having a straglehold on all depts of Govt at the center as well as states is the real bane of this country. Even their counter parts in the Police and other Depts and feel stifled and frustrated because if their control and say in all policy matters.so while General Singh coulld succeed in taking disciplinary action against Army Personnel, the moment he stepped on the MOD territory ,this well planned slur campaign against him was set into motion. They were further emboldened as the Armed Forces by and large were mute spectators to the injustice meted out to him in the DOB acrimony which again was engineered by vested interests which shamefullly included not only general Deepak Kapoor and Avadesh Prasad but also General JJ singh who together masterminded this to ensure his early exit.

Having had success in engineering the sacking of Admiral Bhagwat earlier ,the political class and this scheming bureaucracy wanted a repeat of the Bhagwat like ouster to send a chilling message to the Forces in particular. However unlike in Admiral Bhagwat's case ,this time all Retired generals without exception and their equivalent in other two services have rallied behind General VK Singh because they all have had a taste of the Helplessness and stifled existence in the Service HQs and first hand experience of the autocratic and repressive functioning of the bureaucracy.

It would have been the easiest course of action for him to curry favour with the Govt ,retire on 31 May 12 and secure a GOVERNOR'S tenure for atleast five years like his predecessors, as a price of his silence and acquiescence. Any ordinary mortal would have done that ,but not this man of integrity and honour.a true crusador who has had to suffer tremendous humiliation at the fag end of his glorious career. He not only deserves our appreciation and gratitude for his attempt to cleanse the rot in the MOD and the Govt . He is the true Bharat Ratna.

To that extent Gene

On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 5:17 AM, Randhir Sethi <shebon@gmail.com> wrote:
we have ourselves to blame for the state of the nation

even now it is not too late to rise as ONE , and rid ourselves of this
menace /cancer

bubbles

On 3/29/12, Devasahayam MG <mgd@airtelmail.in> wrote:
> The MoD mess–The Reality
>
> Ex-Major M.G.Devasahayam, 1AS
> (Retd)
>
>
>
> Theopen feud between the Ministry of Defence and the Chief of the Army
> Staff aroseout of the contrived Date of Birth controversy. A corrupt cabal
> had conspiredsince 2006 to truncate Gen. VK Singh's tenure by digging out
> UPSC applicationform and trashing his School Certificate.
>
> Yet, neither the DoB issue is over yet, as is beingwrongly believed, nor
> is the tenure of General VK Singh going to end in thenext two months as is
> being widely claimed. The fact is that Supreme Court hasput the ball back
> in the court of MoD by ruling: "As a matter of fact, thequestion before us
> in the Writ Petition is not about the determination ofactual date of birth
> of the petitioner, butit concerns the recognition of a particular date of
> birth of the petitioner bythe respondent (Government of India) in the
> official service record."
>
> It is therefore imperative that the MoDhas to first pass a legally speaking
> order 'recognising' Gen.VK Singh's realDoB as per law and Rules that hold
> School Certificate as paramount. This hasnot been done and the retirement
> orders of Gen VK Singh have not been served onhim till now. Yet MoD has
> nominated and named his successor (for whose benefit the entire conspiracy
> and manipulation took place) to take over asCOAS on 31 May 2012.
>
> This action is untenable and the real cause of the messthat MoD has got
> into and only they are to be blamed. Instead they are tryingto pass it on
> to Gen. VK Singh by insinuating that he is now a 'frustrated man'and is
> trying to rake up the Tatra bribery issue and leaking out his letter
> on'defence preparedness' to PM to seek revenge. Some MPs, including
> congenitally corruptones, have asked for Gen VK Singh's summary dismissal
> and arrest without evenholding an enquiry!
>
> This way of portraying theserving chief of the Indian Army as an adversary
> just because he is fightingagainst corruption and injustice is wrought with
> serious danger andconsequences. It is our Armed Forces who have defended
> and protected ourdemocracy through their valour, sacrifice and total sense
> of patriotism, bereftof any political ambitions as in our neighbouring
> countries. It is largelybecause of them that India stands tall as a free
> and sovereign Republic. Among the armed forces, the Army is the largest
> andthe most visible face. The chief of that force has a special status in
> thenation's affairs and he cannot be distinguished from the Institution he
> heads. When aninstitution like the Army is impaled, it is the people who
> bleed.
>
> Thepolitico-bureaucratic power coterie that is trying to bulldoze the Army
> Chiefis very distressing. If the serving Army Chief is treated this way and
> thesecorrupt cabals have their final say at least for two generations, no
> militarycommander will raise his head. And the message for military
> commanders will bethat it isn't merit, honesty or integrity that will get
> them promotions andtenures but pandering to the corrupt
> politico-bureaucratic cabal. The lastbastion of professional meritocracy in
> India will be crumbled and the damagewill be lasting.
>

> *This is an open war between the honest and the corrupt and cannot

> becountenanced in the interest of national security and integrity in

> governanceIit time people with conscience stood up and be counted..*
>