Re: [IAC#RG] The ONE issue for the IAC movement.

Sarbajit,

  Whilst I am entirely in agreement with your Nail 2, I have reservations about Nail 1 and 3. 

The debate on the right to bear arms is ongoing even in the US in the light of several shootings in schools, gurudwaras etc. I do not think India is ready for such a law. If indeed such a law is considered AND we are a federation of states, then we also need to consider the right to secede. If I am not mistaken, there is such a clause in the US Constitution. That could end up in balkanisation as so many insurgencies are raging for several decades without resolution. Availability of arms would also add fuel to these movements. I do not think that the strategic establishment which wields a fair amount of influence over government will agree to any such move.

We have debated the negative vote in detail. We could consider a mini referendum? 

Pavan Nair

On Mon, Apr 1, 2013 at 7:03 AM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Subscribers

A summary of IAC members viewpoints for further discussion.

Vidyut Kale

1 nail = figuring out self-sustainability at the grassroots regardless of imposed circumstances. Supporting with attacking harmful policy. (15 words)

supplemented with
"India against Vampirism."

(Enough blood suckers feeding on the vulnerable.)

1) Attacking harmful policy
2) Determining tenacious self-sustainable grassroot models.

2 Nail : Simplify the running of the country to the point any citizen can understand and engage. All aspects.

"India against Obscurism"

P.Mohana Chandran:

India Against Dishonesty- Be honest to yourself-Respect those who serve- Never respect a person who occupy a Chair which he do not deserve to occupy-Never respect a person merely on account of his wealth-Why some one desires to heap wealth by illegal / improper means ? Money will wipe out his unpleasant past..Let us start respecting persons for their knowledge,efficiency etc. This applies to all human beings.Let it be "World Against Dishonesty"

Tadepalli Triambakakishore
One Nail :    Select model for community building of  Indians to  be Against  Corruption .Select from various models viz; Temple/ church/railways/armed forces

Devender Chopra

1 Nail=  Governance by a single PM, apply laws to control corruption, rest will follow.dev chopra in gurgaon

Pavan Nair

India against inequity. Whether caste or gender or religion or wealth based. Elimination of hunger and poverty and female foeticide. Twenty words! Pavan Nair

Raminder Singh

"India Against INDIANS"
(Dogs and Indians not allowed)
Eliminate bigotry, hatred, ignorance, corruption, discrimination, houses of worship, leaders, followers, media, lawyers, political parties. Instill morality, Dharma, transparency, accountability.. (20 words) Raminder

Rustom Dalal

1 Nail= Complete integrity in all activists to inspire a thousand others.Only practice will inspire followers.We  cant change others. Only ourselves. R R DALAL

Sarbajit Roy
1 Nail = The right of the people to form Militias and keep and bear arms to ensure a secure, free and well regulated State, shall not be infringed.

2 Nail = Indian Polity to
a) Rise above religion
b) Abolish all reservations incl. for elections.
c) Promote merit and a level playing field
d) Give enhanced facilities, education or incentives to socially backward individuals to allow them to advance

3 Nail : The "-1" vote (or right to reject / blackball any candidate)

Past Discussions:

India's problems

1) Absence of Democracy (people's direct participation).
2) Lack of proper governance to favour corporates, cronies and scamsters.
3) Criminalisation of society, coupled with breakdown of law and order.
4) Tensions on our borders, with weakened Armed Forces
5) Dynastic family rule and all pervasive Gandhi-ism
6) Complete breakdown of societal values, education & health delivery systems
7) Rampant corruption in the judiciary
8) Inadequate and crumbling infrastructure
9) Systematic grabbing of land and other natural resources
10) Deeply corrupt media.

On the positive side

1) India has a great Parallel ("black") economy which holds the nation together and insulates us from the economic woes of the rest of the world..
2) India has some of the best laws on the world.
3) India has a common language (English) which is understood almost everywhere in the globe.
4) India has great people who have resisted efforts to divide them
5) India has a functioning bureaucracy of sorts.
6) India has a young population and lack of social security systems..
7) Indians have a "can do" entrepreneurial spirit recognised the world over.
8) India has Bharat to back it up.
9) India has a plurality of faiths,  cultures and value systems.
10) India still has reasonably fair electoral processes.

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Re: [IAC#RG] The ONE issue for the IAC movement.

This is an informative report! Kudos.

The majority viewpoints should be a part of the note which includes the discussions.

Sent from my iPad

On 01-Apr-2013, at 7:03, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Subscribers

A summary of IAC members viewpoints for further discussion.

Vidyut Kale

1 nail = figuring out self-sustainability at the grassroots regardless of imposed circumstances. Supporting with attacking harmful policy. (15 words)

supplemented with
"India against Vampirism."

(Enough blood suckers feeding on the vulnerable.)

1) Attacking harmful policy
2) Determining tenacious self-sustainable grassroot models.

2 Nail : Simplify the running of the country to the point any citizen can understand and engage. All aspects.

"India against Obscurism"

P.Mohana Chandran:

India Against Dishonesty- Be honest to yourself-Respect those who serve- Never respect a person who occupy a Chair which he do not deserve to occupy-Never respect a person merely on account of his wealth-Why some one desires to heap wealth by illegal / improper means ? Money will wipe out his unpleasant past..Let us start respecting persons for their knowledge,efficiency etc. This applies to all human beings.Let it be "World Against Dishonesty"

Tadepalli Triambakakishore
One Nail :    Select model for community building of  Indians to  be Against  Corruption .Select from various models viz; Temple/ church/railways/armed forces

Devender Chopra

1 Nail=  Governance by a single PM, apply laws to control corruption, rest will follow.dev chopra in gurgaon

Pavan Nair

India against inequity. Whether caste or gender or religion or wealth based. Elimination of hunger and poverty and female foeticide. Twenty words! Pavan Nair

Raminder Singh

"India Against INDIANS"
(Dogs and Indians not allowed)
Eliminate bigotry, hatred, ignorance, corruption, discrimination, houses of worship, leaders, followers, media, lawyers, political parties. Instill morality, Dharma, transparency, accountability.. (20 words) Raminder

Rustom Dalal

1 Nail= Complete integrity in all activists to inspire a thousand others.Only practice will inspire followers.We  cant change others. Only ourselves. R R DALAL

Sarbajit Roy
1 Nail = The right of the people to form Militias and keep and bear arms to ensure a secure, free and well regulated State, shall not be infringed.

2 Nail = Indian Polity to
a) Rise above religion
b) Abolish all reservations incl. for elections.
c) Promote merit and a level playing field
d) Give enhanced facilities, education or incentives to socially backward individuals to allow them to advance

3 Nail : The "-1" vote (or right to reject / blackball any candidate)

Past Discussions:

India's problems

1) Absence of Democracy (people's direct participation).
2) Lack of proper governance to favour corporates, cronies and scamsters.
3) Criminalisation of society, coupled with breakdown of law and order.
4) Tensions on our borders, with weakened Armed Forces
5) Dynastic family rule and all pervasive Gandhi-ism
6) Complete breakdown of societal values, education & health delivery systems
7) Rampant corruption in the judiciary
8) Inadequate and crumbling infrastructure
9) Systematic grabbing of land and other natural resources
10) Deeply corrupt media.

On the positive side

1) India has a great Parallel ("black") economy which holds the nation together and insulates us from the economic woes of the rest of the world..
2) India has some of the best laws on the world.
3) India has a common language (English) which is understood almost everywhere in the globe.
4) India has great people who have resisted efforts to divide them
5) India has a functioning bureaucracy of sorts.
6) India has a young population and lack of social security systems..
7) Indians have a "can do" entrepreneurial spirit recognised the world over.
8) India has Bharat to back it up.
9) India has a plurality of faiths,  cultures and value systems.
10) India still has reasonably fair electoral processes.

Post: "indiaresists@lists.riseup.net"
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Help: https://help.riseup.net/en/list-user
WWW : http://indiaagainstcorruption.net.in

Re: [IAC#RG] The ONE issue for the IAC movement.

Dear Subscribers

A summary of IAC members viewpoints for further discussion.

Vidyut Kale

1 nail = figuring out self-sustainability at the grassroots regardless of imposed circumstances. Supporting with attacking harmful policy. (15 words)

supplemented with
"India against Vampirism."

(Enough blood suckers feeding on the vulnerable.)

1) Attacking harmful policy
2) Determining tenacious self-sustainable grassroot models.

2 Nail : Simplify the running of the country to the point any citizen can understand and engage. All aspects.

"India against Obscurism"

P.Mohana Chandran:

India Against Dishonesty- Be honest to yourself-Respect those who serve- Never respect a person who occupy a Chair which he do not deserve to occupy-Never respect a person merely on account of his wealth-Why some one desires to heap wealth by illegal / improper means ? Money will wipe out his unpleasant past..Let us start respecting persons for their knowledge,efficiency etc. This applies to all human beings.Let it be "World Against Dishonesty"

Tadepalli Triambakakishore
One Nail :    Select model for community building of  Indians to  be Against  Corruption .Select from various models viz; Temple/ church/railways/armed forces

Devender Chopra

1 Nail=  Governance by a single PM, apply laws to control corruption, rest will follow.dev chopra in gurgaon

Pavan Nair

India against inequity. Whether caste or gender or religion or wealth based. Elimination of hunger and poverty and female foeticide. Twenty words! Pavan Nair

Raminder Singh

"India Against INDIANS"
(Dogs and Indians not allowed)
Eliminate bigotry, hatred, ignorance, corruption, discrimination, houses of worship, leaders, followers, media, lawyers, political parties. Instill morality, Dharma, transparency, accountability.. (20 words) Raminder

Rustom Dalal

1 Nail= Complete integrity in all activists to inspire a thousand others.Only practice will inspire followers.We  cant change others. Only ourselves. R R DALAL

Sarbajit Roy
1 Nail = The right of the people to form Militias and keep and bear arms to ensure a secure, free and well regulated State, shall not be infringed.

2 Nail = Indian Polity to
a) Rise above religion
b) Abolish all reservations incl. for elections.
c) Promote merit and a level playing field
d) Give enhanced facilities, education or incentives to socially backward individuals to allow them to advance

3 Nail : The "-1" vote (or right to reject / blackball any candidate)

Past Discussions:

India's problems

1) Absence of Democracy (people's direct participation).
2) Lack of proper governance to favour corporates, cronies and scamsters.
3) Criminalisation of society, coupled with breakdown of law and order.
4) Tensions on our borders, with weakened Armed Forces
5) Dynastic family rule and all pervasive Gandhi-ism
6) Complete breakdown of societal values, education & health delivery systems
7) Rampant corruption in the judiciary
8) Inadequate and crumbling infrastructure
9) Systematic grabbing of land and other natural resources
10) Deeply corrupt media.

On the positive side

1) India has a great Parallel ("black") economy which holds the nation together and insulates us from the economic woes of the rest of the world..
2) India has some of the best laws on the world.
3) India has a common language (English) which is understood almost everywhere in the globe.
4) India has great people who have resisted efforts to divide them
5) India has a functioning bureaucracy of sorts.
6) India has a young population and lack of social security systems..
7) Indians have a "can do" entrepreneurial spirit recognised the world over.
8) India has Bharat to back it up.
9) India has a plurality of faiths,  cultures and value systems.
10) India still has reasonably fair electoral processes.

Re: [IAC#RG] BJP Should Project Modi in LS Elections: Ramdev

Dear Mr Hegde

Firstly let me take exception to your remarks about (presumably my) "communist minded politics". You are greatly mistaken if you believe I am a communist or any other form of leftist. On the contrary I am an extreme right wing patriotic TRUE Hindu nationalist who puts all the VHP pseudo-Hindu semi-illiiterate brigade in the shade

Secondly, let me clarify that from what I observe Mr. Narendra Modi is some sort of half-baked Hindu who doesn't seem to understand/follow ABC of Hinduism let alone the XYZ.

As I said there is a very simple test for who is a TRUE Hindu and who is not which can be answered in 2 and only 2 words..

a) Are you a Hindu ? Yes or No.
b) What is the name of your God ? _____

Thirdly about the BJP's governance. BJP is equally a corrupt party as the Congress. The series of MINING scams in BJP ruled states is complete and unimpeachable evidence of it. Karnataka, Goa, Gujarat you name it. I hate to drag the fair name of Mr. Bangaru Lakshman into this discussion or even Mr. Pramod Mahajan (who I got removed from the Cabinet for his extreme corruption)

Fourthly, about NaMo personally. Running Gujarat is very different from running rest of India. His style of working may not translate very well outside his own Gujarat and outside die-hard BJP loyalists. In any case lets see assembly results of Karnataka, Rajasthan, Delhi, MP etc. first

Fifthly, the analysis of Gujarat assembly results show that's NaMo's support base is shifting and is also 'spiky". BJP in Gujarat is also packed with criminals

Sarbajit

On Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 11:42 PM, Prabhakar Hegde <m.prabhakar.hegde@gmail.com> wrote:

I fully endorse with the opinion of Sri Baba Ramdevs opinion and it is not only his view it is the wishes of all people of this country who feel  that Sri Narendra Modi can change the face of this great country. It is not by the congress party who ruled ruin and looted the wealth of this country .

I strongly feel that the I A C should come out to support him not because he is a B J P candidate but to give a good governence to our countries administration he is a strong able candidatewho can motivate youths,womens and appeal mass of this country .So please keep aside your petty egoism and communist minded politics for God sake (if you want to do really a good to this nation) Jai Bharath matha Ki  

On Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 10:45 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

http://news.outlookindia.com/items.aspx?artid=794077

BJP Should Project Modi in LS Elections: Ramdev

Jaipur | Mar 31, 2013

BJP should project Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi as its leader in the next Lok Sabha elections and change its priorities if it wants to return to power, Yoga guru Baba Ramdev said today.

He said that Congress can not return to power due to its anti-people policies but BJP can do it provided it changed its priorities.

"There is some possibility and space for BJP if it changes priorities and thinks about projecting Narendra Modi in next Lok Sabha elections," Ramdev said at a press conference here.

"Modi emerged as a robust leader who has become icon of development and courage and has zero tolerance for corruption but the final decision for his projection is to be taken by the BJP and Sangh," he said.

He said the country today is facing a leadership crisis and people are looking at individuals instead of political parties to bring about a positive change in politics.

"We believe that this will take place and the upcoming Lok Sabha election will be decisive in this direction," he said.

He alleged that the government could not take the issues of corruption and black money to a logical conclusion and that Congress has has no chance of forming the next government at the centre as it has betrayed the people.

"Congress has lost confidence among masses. So many scams worth crores of rupees have come to light and people will not vote for the party," he said.

He accused the Congress of misusing the CBI against its political rivals. "What SP Chief Mulayam Singh Yadav said against Congress and CBI is true," he said.

When asked about the possibility of coming together of all like-minded individuals like Anna Hazare, he said building up social and political pressure was necessary to bring a change in system.

"Anna is a good person but he wants to stay away from politics. Building up political pressure along with social pressure is necessary to change the system. Laws are made and amended in Parliament and not by saints or monks and social activist," he said.

Ramdev, who was in the city to hold meetings with his workers, said he was on a mission to play a big role in Lok Sabha election though he himself will not contest election.

"There should be our, at least, 300 members in parliament so that we can play decisive role and I am working in this direction," he said.

Replying to a question about forming a political party, Ramdev said he was not in a position to comment on it but something conclusive will be announced in April or May.

He said that there are some good individuals in parties like Biju Janata Dal, Telugu Desam Party and Janata Dal (United).

There was a space in the nation for the third front, he said, adding that the situation will clear in some time.

He said that he will conduct mass meetings in May in Rajasthan.

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Re: [IAC#RG] BJP Should Project Modi in LS Elections: Ramdev

I fully endorse with the opinion of Sri Baba Ramdevs opinion and it is not only his view it is the wishes of all people of this country who feel  that Sri Narendra Modi can change the face of this great country. It is not by the congress party who ruled ruin and looted the wealth of this country .

I strongly feel that the I A C should come out to support him not because he is a B J P candidate but to give a good governence to our countries administration he is a strong able candidatewho can motivate youths,womens and appeal mass of this country .So please keep aside your petty egoism and communist minded politics for God sake (if you want to do really a good to this nation) Jai Bharath matha Ki  

On Sun, Mar 31, 2013 at 10:45 PM, Sarbajit Roy <sroy.mb@gmail.com> wrote:

http://news.outlookindia.com/items.aspx?artid=794077

BJP Should Project Modi in LS Elections: Ramdev

Jaipur | Mar 31, 2013

BJP should project Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi as its leader in the next Lok Sabha elections and change its priorities if it wants to return to power, Yoga guru Baba Ramdev said today.

He said that Congress can not return to power due to its anti-people policies but BJP can do it provided it changed its priorities.

"There is some possibility and space for BJP if it changes priorities and thinks about projecting Narendra Modi in next Lok Sabha elections," Ramdev said at a press conference here.

"Modi emerged as a robust leader who has become icon of development and courage and has zero tolerance for corruption but the final decision for his projection is to be taken by the BJP and Sangh," he said.

He said the country today is facing a leadership crisis and people are looking at individuals instead of political parties to bring about a positive change in politics.

"We believe that this will take place and the upcoming Lok Sabha election will be decisive in this direction," he said.

He alleged that the government could not take the issues of corruption and black money to a logical conclusion and that Congress has has no chance of forming the next government at the centre as it has betrayed the people.

"Congress has lost confidence among masses. So many scams worth crores of rupees have come to light and people will not vote for the party," he said.

He accused the Congress of misusing the CBI against its political rivals. "What SP Chief Mulayam Singh Yadav said against Congress and CBI is true," he said.

When asked about the possibility of coming together of all like-minded individuals like Anna Hazare, he said building up social and political pressure was necessary to bring a change in system.

"Anna is a good person but he wants to stay away from politics. Building up political pressure along with social pressure is necessary to change the system. Laws are made and amended in Parliament and not by saints or monks and social activist," he said.

Ramdev, who was in the city to hold meetings with his workers, said he was on a mission to play a big role in Lok Sabha election though he himself will not contest election.

"There should be our, at least, 300 members in parliament so that we can play decisive role and I am working in this direction," he said.

Replying to a question about forming a political party, Ramdev said he was not in a position to comment on it but something conclusive will be announced in April or May.

He said that there are some good individuals in parties like Biju Janata Dal, Telugu Desam Party and Janata Dal (United).

There was a space in the nation for the third front, he said, adding that the situation will clear in some time.

He said that he will conduct mass meetings in May in Rajasthan.

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Re: [IAC#RG] Shanti Bhushan in Sanjay Dutt's Defence !

Dear Naishadh

Greetings to you

(d) can even be all the existing privileged classes like SC, ST, OBC, Muslims, Anglos etc. its not a big deal. It only means that money will be spent on them (through their leaders) so that they do not oppose withdrawal of reservations. Of course entire political class / parties will calculate the numbers and not a single one will publicly oppose withdrawal of reservations. So it needs a different strategy as the Kumar & Kumar Co. has shown us.

IAC does not hold any brief for Sanjay Dutt or his shenanigans. IAC only has a certain (very advanced) point of view on "arms for all" which is not intellectually palatable to honest / decent citizens at the present time.

Sufficeth to say that the leading intellectuals of HRA are united that India needs a 2nd Amendment, and that all citizens, especially minorities, need protection against the State if the State is to be scared of its citizens.

"Citizens should not be scared of their State, the State must be scared of its citizens".

Sarbajit

On Sat, Mar 30, 2013 at 7:02 PM, Joshi NM <naishadhjoshi@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Sarabjit,

Greetings.

As on my part, I fully concur on your points stated at (a)(b)(c). However, point (d) needs to be refined in terms of what is "backward Groups"? -economically, socially, educationally etc.?

On the Issue of Sanjay Dutt, I feel finality of SC judgment need to be disturbed just on the ground of a celebrity claiming fable pretext of self defence. Shanti Bhushan may gain fees or fame as a lawyer. Mr. Katju may embroil in political imbroglio. But IAC ought to take an intellectual stand on SC Judgment needing no review merely on the ground of Dutt claiming self defense or Zebunnisa claiming humanitarian sympathetic ground.

Regards,

-Joshi NM

[IAC#RG] BJP Should Project Modi in LS Elections: Ramdev

http://news.outlookindia.com/items.aspx?artid=794077

BJP Should Project Modi in LS Elections: Ramdev

Jaipur | Mar 31, 2013

BJP should project Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi as its leader in the next Lok Sabha elections and change its priorities if it wants to return to power, Yoga guru Baba Ramdev said today.

He said that Congress can not return to power due to its anti-people policies but BJP can do it provided it changed its priorities.

"There is some possibility and space for BJP if it changes priorities and thinks about projecting Narendra Modi in next Lok Sabha elections," Ramdev said at a press conference here.

"Modi emerged as a robust leader who has become icon of development and courage and has zero tolerance for corruption but the final decision for his projection is to be taken by the BJP and Sangh," he said.

He said the country today is facing a leadership crisis and people are looking at individuals instead of political parties to bring about a positive change in politics.

"We believe that this will take place and the upcoming Lok Sabha election will be decisive in this direction," he said.

He alleged that the government could not take the issues of corruption and black money to a logical conclusion and that Congress has has no chance of forming the next government at the centre as it has betrayed the people.

"Congress has lost confidence among masses. So many scams worth crores of rupees have come to light and people will not vote for the party," he said.

He accused the Congress of misusing the CBI against its political rivals. "What SP Chief Mulayam Singh Yadav said against Congress and CBI is true," he said.

When asked about the possibility of coming together of all like-minded individuals like Anna Hazare, he said building up social and political pressure was necessary to bring a change in system.

"Anna is a good person but he wants to stay away from politics. Building up political pressure along with social pressure is necessary to change the system. Laws are made and amended in Parliament and not by saints or monks and social activist," he said.

Ramdev, who was in the city to hold meetings with his workers, said he was on a mission to play a big role in Lok Sabha election though he himself will not contest election.

"There should be our, at least, 300 members in parliament so that we can play decisive role and I am working in this direction," he said.

Replying to a question about forming a political party, Ramdev said he was not in a position to comment on it but something conclusive will be announced in April or May.

He said that there are some good individuals in parties like Biju Janata Dal, Telugu Desam Party and Janata Dal (United).

There was a space in the nation for the third front, he said, adding that the situation will clear in some time.

He said that he will conduct mass meetings in May in Rajasthan.