Wednesday, November 21, 2012

Re: [IAC++] How Denmark has curbed corruption? c link

Dear Shri Mathew Peedikayil / Shri Vishal Mangalwadi,

Let us not bring a particular religion into this. Everyone has their own faith/belief, or none, and this is not a forum for proselytisation.

Anyway, your point is highly debatable to say the least. Completely almost 100% "Bible-following" countries like Greece and Russia are highly corrupt. Whereas secular and very less religious countries like Denmark and Sweden are not at all corrupt. And non so-called "Biblical" countries like Singapore are among the most transparent.

India is fortunate to have a clear separation of Church and State, let's keep it that way. The last thing we want is to become is a place like Saudi Arabia or Iran, or even a milder version like Russia, where there is no tolerance, leave alone respect, for diverse beliefs.


Respectfully,
Jawahar



Begin forwarded message:

From: Mathew Peedikayil <drspmathew@gmail.com>
Date: November 21, 2012 4:11:42 AM EST
To: iac@lists.riseup.net
Subject: Re: [IAC++] How Denmark has curbed corruption? c link
Reply-To: iac@lists.riseup.net

Arun Joshi has hit the nail on the problem... our heart. No matter what the technology, the human mind can devise ways to fool it. 
That is why a change of heart is most important. 
The only thing that has ever worked is what changed Europe: The Reformation, which started with Martin Luther.


The great challenge of every civilization and culture throughout world history has been to find a source of meaning, a ground from which it can act. Some societies have looked to many local and regional gods. Others have postulated that life's goal is to achieve oneness with the absolute nothingness that constitutes ultimate reality. Still others have looked to esoteric philosophic and religious mysteries. However, each of these has failed to provide the basis for a lasting and ascendant civilization. 
But the only civilization that has looked largely to the Bible for its inspiration, the West, has been able to conquer human cruelty, hopelessness and degradation with such success that it has become the envy of the rest of the world.

Vishal Mangalwadi



On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 at 1:32 PM, arun joshi <colarun.joshi@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Col Khera,
Pardon the interruption.
I was fortunate to attend a course MMA (ADP) in 1987 (Middle Management appreciation- automated data processing) There was one prayer our instructors recited daily.........
"Gentlemen ,these systems as they evolve are support systems. Remember it is absolutely essential for the man behind the machine to be true to his job.
I fully subscribe to your views of e governance. It will assist in reducing corruption to a discernible extent. However not until our genes (especially Govt servants) are completely overhauled would we see an improvement. 
I am presently struggling to obtain a birth certificate. Struggling because I refused to pay the Lady Rs 1000/-. RTI and a personal interview with the Commissioner of the City has not helped as yet. 
Nevertheless I have not yet lost hope.
With Regards


On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 4:16 PM, Mahesh Khera <mkkhera@yahoo.com> wrote:
Dear M/s Kris and Iftikhar,

We must thank you for bringing out such live examples to the people of India. I am happy to see this as also the curiosity of the people as to when a small democratic country like Denmark can be No 1 least corrupt country then India the world's greatest democracy can also be similar.

I must share with you that in Oct 2010, in a seminar on mobile broadband, I brought out that Denmark has achieved No 1 rank in least corrupt index due to their commitment to implement their national e governance program. The two secys to the government of India were on the chair. Secy DoT just dismissed me that I do not know any thing that India has a National E Governance Plan (NeGP) 2005 and this is under implementation. The other gentleman, Chairman TRAI did appreciate what I said and he was of the opinion that India seriously needs to look at what Denmark has done. For Danish NeGP, they have had huge broadband penetration in the country over which their NeGP, inter-alia,  touching upon every national infrastructure project right from e-RFP, to e-tendering, e-bidding, e-purchase order, e-implementation monitoring and e-operations monitoring has been included. You can imagine our NeGP 2005, the less said the better. We had 2G scam, CWG scam, Coal scam, host of mining, land, power scams and so on. Going forward, we have a $ trillion financial outlay in our 5 year plan, an unlimited money for nation building and some people must be licking their fingers. Suppose, we were actually implementing the real NeGP 2005, all these scams would not have been there. If at all some one does then the e evidence which is indelible in nature can nail the person(s) and within less than a year, the guilty is/are prosecuted, sentenced and find themselves in jail. Imagine, the huge deterrent which true NeGP can bring to the corruption. This is what Denmark has successfully implemented.

I would be happy to contribute to the real India's NeGP through Telecom, Media and Technology (TMT) which in conjunction with Jan Lok Pal can give 90 % relief to India from corruption. For more details, would request you to please click the URL  http://www.ktmt.in/Recent%20News/News_24.aspx
 
With warm regards,

Col Mahesh Khera

From: Kris Dev <krisdev@gmail.com>
To: iac@lists.riseup.net; iftikhar.gilani@gmail.com
Sent: Monday, 19 November 2012 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: [IAC++] How Denmark has curbed corruption? c link

Iftikar,

I like the way Denmark has done. Do you think it's possible in India? If yes, how do we make it happen?

Best,

Kris Dev





--
"He/she should not do that which he/she knows to be wrong, and suffer the consequence whatever it may be, this is the key to the use of soul-force." ( Hind Swaraj , p. 69).

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